🇺🇸 · Noisebridge · Nthmost
Auto-posted meeting notes for 2026_06_30 (meetingnotes) New page {{meetings2026}} These are the notes from the [https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Category:Meeting_Notes The 870th Meeting of Noisebridge]. {|class="wikitable" style="text: left;" ! style="text-align:left;"| Date | 2026-06-30 |- ! Note-taker[s] | [[User:ChazVellication|Chaz]], [[User:NEWMAN|NEWMAN]] [[User:Gabaghoul]] |- ! Moderator[s] | [[User:Nthmost|Nthmost]] |} {|class="wikitable" | [[Meeting_Notes_2026_06_23|Previous Meeting]] | [[Meeting_Notes_2026_07_07|Next Meeting]] |} = Introductions = * Prompt: Name - pronouns - funnest thing in your life right now (NB or otherwise) * Heather: she/her - laser engraving * James: he/him - learning bbq from a friend * Chaz: he or whatever - setting up the first LAN for deadlock * Logan: - New input method (joystick>wasd) * Michael: hey man / dude - STS2 * Chris (blitz): he dude guy - spending time in my shop * Elan: he/they - bikes, sleeping, my partner's dog * Newman: Outdoor climbing * Jet: they/them - got a new job! (boos) and got Cyberpunk 2077 (Alex: YAY) * (who?) she/her - getting into chess * Zacchae (added by someone other than Zacchae ->)He/Him: Scheming () * Cloud She/Her: Three Burgers in one sitting * LX male pronouns: Noisebridge, Warhammer mini painting * Loren He/Him: Talking to randoms on twitter, NoiseGarden * Gwen (afk?) * Marion (in-and-out * Naomi she/they/dude - going outside reading books = Short announcements and events = * Chaz: opensauce is looking for volunteers, we have floor space left for projects. talk to Jet, Chaz, or Alex. * Naomi: Hayden from the welding crew wants to bring the welding class back here in September. Likely same deal (clear & reserve the downstairs Wed-Sun, flat fee, discounts on the class for NB members). Discussion item if needed (any concerns from last time?) * Elan: Twitter has sobered up, the 86 page is back. * Naomi: tangent, I filed a PR to drop the 86 page from the wiki dumps. * Chaz: confirmed, yeah, it's not in there. = Excellence = '''Our One Rule is to Be Excellent to Each Other.''' What does that mean? Please see our page on [[Excellence]] ! '''Chaz:''' i think excellence is leaving things better than found, listening, not being a dick. == Anti-Harassment Policy & Community Standards of Excellence == Noisebridge has an [[Anti-Harassment Policy]]! Everyone is expected to follow the Anti-Harassment Policy, please familiarize yourself with it.) For approachable & specific guidelines see: [[Community Standards]] Please note: '''https://safespace.noisebridge.net/ is one way to quickly raise issues which will be seen by people in Discord.''' == Brief Kudos == * Derek showing what the upstairs floor could be -- cleaned a line of floor '''Heather:''' retro kudos for web Daniel for the "projector doohickey" '''Chaz:''' Derek helped me replace an outlet upstairs, and took out a bunch of trash '''Blitz:''' Carl & Derek cleaned out the machine shop! = [[Guild]]s & [[WG]]s = '''Sewing:''' Monthly meeting July 16th - Leave the tables clean, Report when things are left out - Industrial Sewing Machines are 'expert machines' - only use with proper training, can self-teach, next meeting for other sewing guild things on July 16th Treasurer guild update: Two emails have been recived about expenses - Dryyn 40$ Judy -Judy should talk to Loren about getting a check, Zacchae still getting 'verified' by the bank. $1000 in McMaster fees requested by Elan $200 Coffee Table is broken, LX will replace it with a TV he has for reimbursement. = New Members/Access Members = it's Chaz's 4th week applying for Core Membership INTERROGATE '''Newman:''' why do you want to be a core member? '''Chaz:''' I like contributing to the space. Sometimes that requires blocking a consensus item and I don't want to do that by proxy. I want to steward the space and core member seems like a good way to be that. '''Loren:''' I want to hear other reasons than blocking. '''Chaz:''' Blocking is an objective rational reason but as a cultural reason i do feel that thing your talking about the way other members talk about noisebridge i feel like. I feel really into the space. I want to figure out what the mold is and choose to fit in it or not fit in it. '''LX:''' Can you give an example of something people might suggest that you'd block? And why? Hypothicaly...Not like the moon be made aof cheese but like yeah '''Chaz:''' Umm hmm maybe like there was the noisetor thing that happened recently and i didn't know alot about that. When I heard about that and Julius blocked it I'm glad he did and would have if he didn't. Maybe something like requiring monthly dues for a machine is something I would block. '''LX:''' What would you expect to happen after you block it? '''Chaz:''' I would expect people to question my block, and people would associate me with that decicion. '''Heather:''' If a non-member wants to block a consensus. '''Chaz:''' I wouldn't block an issue i raised '''Michael:''' how long have you been coming to the space Chaz: 3 monthes '''Michael:''' Do you think you really understand the space and how it operates? '''Chaz:''' I think i have a good surface level understand and ivce been talking with LX and Naomi, working with them on projects. The short anwser is no. '''Michael:''' I appriciate you, if you dont get core membership, how would you react '''Chaz:''' I came into this meeting knowing it would maybe not pass, Thats fine. I would still come to NB '''Zacchae:''' I don't like how Julius blocked that item. It seemed like he was preemtively blocking before hering about the plan and it seemed like when he actually heard it he was less against it. '''Chaz:''' I don't think that quite how that went. '''Chris:''' Have you read the bylaws '''Chaz:''' NO '''Chis:''' What value would having core membership give you other than blocking '''Chaz:''' I dont know, it seems like its for someone who cares about the space. Also noting it's weird timing for me applying for membership as i'm one of the people raising the issue of "what even is a Core Member" '''Heather:''' Suppose someone in the space comes up to you and says they don't feel space due to someone else. How do you respond? '''Chaz:''' ATL the accused person and mediate online, either person A or B needs to not be inn the space '''Heather:''' Would you be comfertable atl'ing them? '''Chaz:''' Yes '''Loren:''' We talked about updates to the membership form, you were exploring. What would you add to that checklist? '''Chaz:''' Plans to update that checklist. There should be a checklist for sponsors, to attest to what they're conveying. '''Loren:''' I did want to emphasize, yeah, not just the checklist of actions, but adding to the preamble, which is a reminder that -- this checklist is list of reminders to consider, ensure we're happy about, we're serving * we need to uphold - the community, ensuring that we're not driving away contributors, participants -- that's the engine of the space, community * we need to uphold activities & events of the space * we have to uphold the non-profit, our mechanism for interfacing with the world CHAZ LEAVES THE ROOM '''Zacchae:''' My pet peeve. I got involved around the time a certain person applying to core member wanted, to be a member "in order to block". (? chris lx ?): I think Chaz will make a great member--but what's the rush? -- co-signed, for the record, by Zacchae, Heather, Loren (... - co '''Naomi:''' The amount of procedure and questioning we're doing are more than the previous decade '''Alex:''' I sponsored Chaz. It seems like a riddle of sphinx. It seems like it shouldn't be held against applicants for saying they want to be a core member to do the things that only core members can do. He has a connection with all kinds of groups like board game groups and it would be great to have him bring in these people. '''Zacchae:''' I guess i disagree a little bit. You said you think Chaz didn't understand blocking. Consensus doesn't not require core members to be around. There is a right answer to this why question. (As--I'm not--an access member) You are becoming a core member because you understand the necesity for people needing to block and I trust myself not to abuse that power. '''Elan:''' I don't have an understanding of consensus. Its kind of vibesy. Temperament is an interesting thing to consider. Being a non-contentious person goes very far. Zachae is not an access member. You can do great things without authority. '''Alex:''' Quick point on the process. I don't see it in the official consensus page or the bilaws but everytime a Consensus measure passed a core member has been present. We haven't approved one without a core member. '''Naomi:''' This is why its important to disambiguate between big C and little c consensus. '''Zacchae:''' I have a proposal for how to do this. Maybe for Kavya and Chaz. The only reason we block them is because they say they want to block items. Multiple supports '''Naomi:''' Can we bring chaz back in? '''Naomi:''' We all have an appetite for this discussion CHAZ IS BACK '''Naomi:''' You have been blocked. '''Naomi:''' When I joined as a member in 2009, two people sponsored me, and that was it. we've shifted the goal posts quite a bit. '''Zacchae:''' a direct response to * "it's not clear" - ... * [on blocking] '''Naomi:''' we've set up a riddle of the sphinx '''Chaz:''' Every time for Kavya and I have applied, people are raising questions about what a core member is. There's a lot of people saying we should define these things. I haven't been around long enough to do this. '''Naomi:''' these things are unclear, because they've been unclear for years. There are probably certain things we don't want to write down. Checklist... Don't want it to be a "study for the test" kind of thing. == Spending Needs == * == Fundraising Update == = Consensus Items = [don't think there are any? --nthmost] = Discussion Items = == 1: Open Sauce Volunteers/Projects == {{DiscussionItem| | topic = Open Sauce Volunteers/Projects | raised_by = Chaz, Jet, LX | seeking = outcome }} '''Jet:''' Opensauce in 17 days , We have a booth, bout this big <--- 0_0-----> We are demonstrating lots of NB projects, currently we have two spots, requesting 8 spots, if this intrests you contact me. '''Michae:''' Exact Date? '''Jet:''' July 17th - 19th '''Heather:''' Where '''Jet:''' Its in San Mateo '''Alex:''' Is it possible to badge swap. Can we swap out between two people if someone can't be there the whole time? '''Jet:''' Yes thats the plan to swap 4 - 6 people that are helping do individual things == 2: vibe check on talking to politicians (as NB members) == {{DiscussionItem| | topic = vibe check on talking to politicians (as NB members) | raised_by = Elan | seeking = decision/outcome/advice/[?] }} '''Elan:''' Some of you may have seen solderfumes and <> on discord taling about this 3d printing bill. politicians don't understand 3d printing. 200 people showed up. at the end all of the people on the committee were like huh we don't understand whats going on. daniel and i on the way back suggested we help educate these politicians (the people on the committee). idea is we invite scott wiener and others into the space to educate about 3d printers. '''Blitz:''' one of the biggest parts of noisebridge is helping people learn shit. even when those people are politicians. i strongly am in favor of this. '''The Table:''' ditto '''Elan:''' just a little anecdote somehone was like are there any restrictions? does it apply to chocolate sugar too? then someone said i don't think its a good idea to have chocolate guns. == 3: complaint about roofers not handling locks properly == {{DiscussionItem| | topic = complaint about roofers not handling locks properly | raised_by = Heather | seeking = decision/outcome/advice/[?] }} '''Heather:''' Roofers were here recently, first day they were told to lock the buildin. They locked me in. They're also propping the gate open. Josh also has compaints about the roofers. '''Heather:''' the roofers locked me and one other person in. they also prop the gate open alot. josh also has complaints but i won't speak for him. '''Chaz:''' We should make a protocol for contractors (don't lock or prop doors ever, without explicit permission, etc. '''Newman:''' do we have a say? '''Zacchae:''' yes we have a say we can talk to the landlord '''Loren:''' how we can build up something to say to landlord: bike people park in that area. people steal from in the gate. leaving the gate open leaves members opens to threat. the gate is our main filter to our space, so this breaks down our barriers for security. list of things contractors not doing. really clear atomic things. build this up over time. build a story. not just repeating a story of roofers who don't care for our rules. '''Heather:''' The mention of security , they let in someone who didnt have a key card. it turned out fine but the circumstances were somewhat jarring. Let's document what should or shouldn't be done. '''Zacchae:''' email the landlord, asking them to forward to the roofer '''Loren:''' let's put that list on the wiki, for living text, living requests. (and roofer-contractor specific requests -- and general requests for contractors) '''Heather:''' volunteered to make a digital follow-up (good prompting Chaz) '''Naomi:''' Let the notes show that heather has volunteered to digitally make this happen. == 3: revoking an 86 == {{DiscussionItem| | topic = revoking an 86 | raised_by = Quinn | seeking = decision/outcome/advice/[?] }} '''Naomi:''' There is a webpage for path to 86 that tells how to undo an 86. Have you looked at this? '''Quinn:''' Yes I have, and I have questions. When i was at the meeting 2 years it started as a 6 month atl. then when i left it seemed to escalate. '''Naomi:''' Who is this about? '''Quinn:''' Benjamin "wiki" '''Elan:''' Whats the reason for bringing this up? '''Quinn:''' This was in 2024, Ben has changed alot and is a different person. He's involved in different maker spaces. '''Naomi:''' Its important to have a sponsor within the community and repair the damage that was done. '''Elan:''' I have very hazy recolection of this, there were other important things happening at the time. '''Quinn:''' Sha and I left that night and explained that it was a 6 month ban, but that turned into a perm 86 without our voices being heard '''Elan:''' I recall that Ben was asked to leave but had a hot temper and was resistent to leave. I suspect what happened next was ... being resistent to being to asked to leave likely escalated it into an 86. '''Naomi:''' These are some comments online. Cloud witnessed him push W/Z to the ground, He was recorded shouting at people, 5 hours of yelling. THere are people in the community that are still active that were directly affected by that....There no clear and simple way to get off the 86 page because we dont want that person back. '''Cloud:''' Adding to notes (after) to clarify my comments online, I was witness to the events that led to Benji 86 on the year 2023-2024. Benji was asked to leave the space but returned inspite of the ATL. Which was a contributing factor to the 86. The meeting notes can be found somewhere Feb-May 2024 at NB's wiki page. There were several events during mediation with moderators, (and can list the moderators present year 2024) where I witnessed Benji and Frosma yelling at the individuals moderating the event for hours, (5 hours each session). Twice. listed below are only two of the events recorded on wiki notes (there were a few more). https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2024_03_05 https://www.noisebridge.net/wiki/Meeting_Notes_2024_03_12 Inspite of the calm, the situation kept escalating without stopping. Benji was asked to leave. But kept returning. And did create a safety issue (posed physical risk) for those affected unable to partipate in the community because of of the constant yelling, intimidation, and escalation. I recall other members such as W/Z trying to descalate the situation by "We as Noisebridge community are a family" before that meeting, and W/Z was shoved to the ground by Benji. Quinn and then 2nd man (Moon) were aware this happened to others in the community back in year 2024. Please triple, quadruple check with the events, situations, and people that led to the 86 of Benji before reversing the decision. The ATL then eventual 86 was not honored and misrepresented at this current meeting 6/30/2026. '''Quinn:''' I just feel like it was unfair and decided without a wider discussion. '''Naomi:''' We don't decide to put people on the 86 page by consensus. It's generally a group of people who have already given a lot of time and energy to the issue and don't see the benefit of expending further energy on the person. '''Elan:''' There was a large discussion after the events unfolded [well documented, too --nthmost] '''Quinn:''' He is volenteering at fronteir tower '''Elan:''' There are not alot of reversing 86's, vouching for someone that they've changed their behavior is a huge task. I'm certainly not volunteering to mediate this. '''Naomi:''' NEXT! == 2: Core Membership and sponsorship responsibilities == {{DiscussionItem| | topic = Core Membership and sponsorship responsibilities | raised_by = Chaz | seeking = discussion }} '''Chaz:''' i wrote something on this, hold on, i don't think i want to be a large part of this conversation. i just don't know enough to be a part of this disccusion. i keep getting riddle of the sphinx answers. i just want to know. The Big Four (answer for both roles!) # Does this role have any responsibilities in the space that a 'small m' member does not have? # Does this role have any access/capabilities in the space that a 'small m' member does not have? # What are the requirements for these roles? # What does it mean to sponsor a member for this tier of membership? '''Naomi:''' the frustration is absolutely appropriate. We've been trying to do a better job of describing this. '''Heather:''' Formal ability to sponser,Formal ability to Block a consecus item or member, Legal representation of the nonprofit '''Michael:''' Some of those thing are clearer than other, What exactly does it meant o be legaly rep? and what is a big C concsesus item? '''CHaz:''' Theres a part that has a concrete def, and some that doesnt.What is a big C consensus proposal? Heather: Concrete, Formal sponsor for membership, formal ability to block Concensus proposal,membership, legal membreship of nonprofit. These are the 'hard, mechanical, aspects'. '''Naomi:''' When it impacts everyone, potentially changing something about how NB works for more than just that one situation. '''Elan:''' If its very hard to reverese, Like getting rid of big piece of equipment, or covering up someones big mural. '''Naomi:''' for example, i dislike that we tear down the Flaschentaschen. if i wanted to keep it in place instead of letting it get taken to shows i might intro a consensus proposal that says "we keep the FT in place and in NB." '''Newman:''' I have a question about the mural. I usually tell people its ok to put up art but keep it in good taste. '''Elan:''' ideally you know the things that people value and you stick up for them. '''Naomi:''' How does a bill become a law ? '''Michael:''' Is paying dues part of being a core member? '''Elan:''' i think paying dues is part of being a core member. you are making a monetary donation on a monthly basis. '''Zacchae:''' If you hand me a nickel with your name i will record that you gave me that. *Newman hands a nickle with his name on it to zacchae* '''Naomi:''' Back to the topic, to prevent the trauma that chaz and kavya just went through of solving the sphnix riddle, how do we prevent this? LX :I tried to write down what i could about this in notes, Noise bridge has not preprared the memeber for applying for this member ship. Being a sponsor should mean that you are prepared to sponser someone into a core member, seeing that someone else is ready to give others the tools to helpo the community '''Loren:''' The whole point of being strict about the membership process is to head off future trauma for many people, for the whole community, of blocking consensus by electing members who aren't ready to seek more broad-based consensus. '''Naomi:''' TBC I was NOT saying "people are experiencing emotional pain from rejection, therefore we should stop vetting people." I'm pointing back at the problem: how do we improve our process so it's more successful at producing excellent core members, and less likely to leave people feeling confused and rejected b/c our process is dumb and confusing. '''Zacchae:''' We dont have to make it more formal, we shouldn't give people tongue twister questions. They should know the answer, and try to convince us of it: "I want to become a member because I know that members must exist to make the space run, and believe I won't abuse the privileges of it." '''Heather:''' We went back over meeting notes before we joined to see the vetting process. We didn't find any. '''Naomi:''' We are taking way more notes than we used to. '''Elan:''' There was some setting expectation issues , Whether I block or how I evaluate someones core mem, Seeing if this person promotes our bylaws and wont get us in legal trouble, and cleans up after our themselves! is the most important. '''Loren:''' I spent about 2 years between knowing i would become a member and involved enough to be a router for people. consensus at noisebridge is kinda like knowing where people stand before trying to bring it to the table to have the final decision about it. I feel like there can be systems that feel icky that operate in this way of relying on what are perhaps whisper networks. We promise that we will try everything we can to coordinate with people so we have barriers to saying we will always try to coordinate with people. LX :I LIKE THE IDEA THAT being able to give a good tour is a part of being a good member. '''Chaz:''' I just want to reiterate my questions I call big 4 for people to answer in the discord forum: 1. does this have roles small m members do not have. 2. does this big m member have capabilities small m members do not have. 3. what are the requirements for these roles. 4. what does it mean to sponsor for this tier of membership. We want to have enough overlap on our definitions so when we propose a diff we agree what we are changing. CHAZ :Right now erase my my questions that are called a big four and I want you to think about that and I would really love if for some of the Discord for him and these apply for both rules the first is does this role have any responsibilities in space that a small M members does not have a second is does this role have any access / capabilities in the space that a small end member does not have a third is what are the requirements for these roles and fourth is what does it mean to sponsor a member for this. Member shit we don't I'm not asking anyone to answer those questions right now I I just I think I I posit that they are the four of the most Central questions to defining what it actually means to be the thing and I think step one is not proposing edit to what the role rolls currently are I think Step One is making sure that there's enough overlap on the definitions such that when you propose a gift or agreeing on what we're actually changing I'm a martyr for noisebridge '''Blitz:''' How by the letter of the law from legal definitions of members do we want this place to be? Members is a legal definition for a dues paying member of a charitable 501c3 with legal responsibilities for member sand board to them. '''Chaz:''' My questions were not written with any legal considerations in mind. '''Blitz:''' I figured. Only reason I bring it up is because some damn fool nominated me for board and didn't say no. I haven't been here for much longer and I'm not core member I'm on board (been here 6 months) but I couldn't tell you what a core member is except for legal definition the rest is a vibe check. '''Loren:''' Good points on the legal def. We do every year as we run board elections and we pay attention to this. Even if core members respect nominations and blocks of associate members board pays attention to this as well. '''Heather:''' To comment on big 4 questions: 1. "do they have any responsibilities" I don't know if I agree, but I would say expectations. '''Chaz:''' No could be the answer? '''Blitz:''' You ARE responsible for electing board members. '''Michael:''' Do we need to have more discussions right now? I'm curious to know what that means. '''Loren:''' Do you feel responsible to NB or to guild? '''Nthmost:''' I think we got some good ideas and we can continue talking about it online. = Do-ocratic Task Board = Participation also means doing stuff to contribute to the space. Propose new tasks or pick some tasks from [https://github.com/noisebridge/buildout-capp Github], from what needs to be done around you, or whatever, and see if someone will sign up to work on that task. Anyone can sign up and it's a great way to show you are contributing! = End of Meeting = [[Category:Meeting Notes]]